Transcript

Clay: This is The Stock Trading Reality Podcast, episode 298. Hey, it’s Clay. Real quick, before we get to the episode, I want to just bring to your attention one of the most common questions I get, and it’s a wise question. It’s something that makes sense to be asking. “Hey, Clay, what is a good broker for a beginner? I want to trade stocks. What would you recommend ideally if it’s got zero commissions?” That would be Webull. They are a fantastic platform. What I like to apply is known as that platform hat method, HAT.
Clay: First off, the H. Does the platform give you the ability to hunt for stocks, to find good stocks? Webull actually does. The A, the analysis, does a platform give you the ability to analyze whatever stocks you have hunted and found? With Webull, it absolutely does. Then, the T, take action. You can hunt out stocks, you can grow an analysis on them, but if you can’t actually take action and put everything into motion, well, then a platform is not going to do you very much good. Once again, Webull is very, very beneficial for allowing you to take action with whatever sort of stocks and then strategies you are looking to take advantage of.
Clay: Are they the be all, end all? They’re not. There’s lots of good platforms out there, but when it comes to the quality of charts they give, when it comes to the zero-dollar commissions and the ease at which you can sign up, they have a great app for your phone, I would say at least give them a try. Go to claytrader.com/webull and you can learn more, all about them, but let’s now get to the episode.
Announcer: This is The Stock Trading Reality Podcast, where you get to see the realistic side of a trader’s journey. Get inspired and stay motivated by everyday, normal people who are currently on their journey to trading success. This is your host, his mind was blown after watching The Social Dilemma, ClayTrader.
Clay: Wow, do I highly recommend it. If you have not seen the documentary The Social Dilemma, give it a look. I don’t agree with everything. Some of the people they interview… I would say this, we probably disagree on some areas of life, but I’m also objective enough to give credit where credit’s due and some of the things that they point out, I mean, I’m fully onboard. I respect their opinion. I believe it’s the right opinion, but it is absolutely crazy how interwoven social media has become. You understand both sides of the equation, especially like myself, someone that is a business owner, and I can understand why it’s set up the way it is.
Clay: It’s smart why it’s set up the way it is from the business perspective, but also the way it’s set up the way it is, it creates a bunch of collateral damage that, like I said, I’m not going to say is intended. Maybe it is intended. I suppose there’s a bunch of theories in and of itself there, but it is just a mess and it’s a mess where any angle you look at it, you can be like, “Yeah, that’s a good point.” Then, you look at it from another angle, “Well, yeah, that’s a good point.” If I was in that situation, again as a business owner, I wouldn’t want to be wasting my money. If I can use my marketing dollars to make it as efficient as possible, well, that’s just good business right there.
Clay: If you have not seen The Social Dilemma, my mind truly blown, I would highly recommend you check it out, especially, and I’m by no means a parenting expert, that’s not what I’m trying to portray. All I will say is that my kids are not going to be having a cellphone until probably at least high school, but middle school, no way. They’re definitely not going to be on social media in middle school. A little spoiler, and here is the driving force behind that, when a few of the big creators that had ground-level entries and roles in creating these social media networks, when those people are like, “No, my kids aren’t going to be on it,” if that doesn’t tell you something, I don’t know what will. That’s the only spoil I’ll give you, but I would just say go and definitely check it out.
Clay: Now, as far as our interview today, fantastic, good stuff. Geoff is back for the third time and a little bit of a unique episode here. We start off with him having stepped away from the market because he’s got a very successful business. All right, I’m not even going to play that off. My wife came in to bring me something and I looked around and she kind of scared me, so that’s why I was stumbling over my words.
Clay: Like I said, we’re all friends here. This is episode 200-something, so I can speak freely, but that’s why I lost my train of thought, but we’re talking to Geoff. Geoff has stepped away from the market because he’s got a super successful business, which he talks a little bit about. Now, things are transitioning because, like any entrepreneur, like anybody that’s looking to create multiple streams of income, you got to identify opportunities and then start to figure out, “Okay, how can I get that opportunity back in place?”
Clay: That’s where Geoff’s at right now. He’s getting ready to enter back into the markets, get that side income and side stream of income into place here. We talk about that, talk about what his plans are, how he’s going to be approaching it and some regrets, so a lot of good stuff, and especially if you’re somebody that maybe has a full-time job and you were thinking, “You know, I love this market stuff, but with my work schedule, I just don’t think it’s possible.” Just give this a listen. Just give this a listen because, again, this is coming from somebody that is a super, super busy guy with the business that he has. Without further ado, let’s hear about Geoff and get an update on his journey.
Clay: Geoff, welcome back to the show.
Geoff: Thanks, Clay.
Clay: I’m going to be honest, I don’t remember. Is this your second or third appearance on the show?
Geoff: This is third.
Clay: Third? Okay.
Geoff: Yeah.
Clay: I thought it might have been the third, but I thought, “You know what? I was about 60-40 that this is either the second or third.” While I appreciate you coming back and I appreciate you volunteering to do this, you showed up in the chat room and it was a very stressless situation to have you come on. Some guests, they need a little bit more tooth-pulling than others, but yours was not a problem at all, so thank you very much on that note.
Geoff: No problem.
Clay: Well, I guess, and for listeners’ sake, Geoff has been on three times before, but he’s not a total regular in the chat room because he’s out there hustling and grinding in many other ways. This is a situation where nothing is scripted here. You just get to be a fly on the wall of a conversation that I really have no idea where it’s going to take us. I don’t know what he’s really been up to, hence, the point of having him back. For all I know, Geoff is getting ready to curse me out because he thinks I’m the biggest scumbag in the world. I don’t know what’s about to happen, but I’m looking forward to trying to figure things out.
Clay: I guess, really, Geoff, in order to give listeners as much context as possible, not that I expect you to remember every little detail, but maybe [crosstalk 00:06:46] summarize where things started for you. Maybe, to the best of your ability, those first two episodes that you were on, and then we can try to build off from there, but let’s just, like I said, the best I can. I realize this was years ago, but summarize those first two episodes that you were on.
Geoff: Okay. Sounds good. Yeah, the basis is that I’d gotten my start messing around a few quite a long time ago, now, actually, probably around 20 years ago with day trading a little bit. The basis on those shows was that I’d met a client that turned into a friend that was a trader that traded several million dollars every day and kind of some of the mentorship, I guess, that I got from that. I’d always done home and commercial automation systems, so smart homes for more clarification, but so I was kind of doing that. I would day trade some and then kind of go back and forth. Then, I got into the penny stock with that some, and then fast forward a few years and so traded for a while pretty actively.
Geoff: Then, up until what’s happened in the last years or so, I went through a divorce. I think last time we talked was right after I’d gotten divorced, actually, so I went through that and a lot of life changing and moving on and restructuring. I’ve always done a lot of businesses and kept things kind of busy, so that kind-
Clay: Okay, well-
Geoff: … brings us up to where we were at the end of the last ones.
Clay: Awesome, awesome. Yeah. You were probably good in school when you had to work on like summary sentences and like the summary paragraphs. You must have gotten an A+ in all of that. All right, well, you went through the divorce we were talking last time, so I suppose, what was your structure at that point from a trading standpoint? Then, in your words, your life situations and all of that, did that affect anything? Did it put it on pause, I guess? Where did things begin to go from that point? It sounds like that’s where we left off the last time you were on.
Geoff: Right. Yeah, it kind of put things on pause. Rebuilding net worth, get some money back to be able to trade with, things like that and really the focus more than anything. When you’re struggling and trying to go back to what you know, what I knew the most was doing automation systems, so kind of picked back up on that. Was very blessed and lucky that the economy was very strong because the majority of my client base is all high net worth individuals, so I’ve been really, really busy with that, which is great.
Geoff: Run around doing that and honestly, I have not traded a lot. I kind of missed the big dip and the big rise where, obviously, I’m sure a lot of people did really well with it. I had a lot of clients that did really well, so I’m sure you guys did, too, but I was kind of out of it. I was focused on doing some things with some land in real estate. That’s kind of where I’ve been focused lately.
Clay: Okay, and just for listeners’ sake, you’re not talking about automation systems where you’re just are like doing it in your local community. If I remember right, you travel all over the place to-
Geoff: Right.
Clay: … do these systems, right?
Geoff: That’s correct, so yeah. There’s a lot of companies, well, not a lot. A decent amount of companies do what I do that are only local, but my little niche, I guess, was that I would fly around and do jobs. I’m based out of North Carolina, that we would do a lot of projects, California, Canada, all up and down the East Coast and the products in the UK, China, South Africa, Germany, all through Europe and everything, too. That was pretty big, really, the overseas stuff.
Geoff: I sold the company to my minority business party a few years ago and he’s kind of taken over that end of things, so I’m focusing on… I take care of one of the universities here. I take care of all of their sports stuff, the two groups who mostly have the educational part, of course, where classroom systems, things like that. Then, you have the foundation stuff, which is like where they bring in money for the schools, so football, basketball, those kind of things. I handle one of the big universities in the country’s… all of their locker room stuff and coaches and all of that kind of stuff.
Geoff: That’s slowed down, of course, with everybody closed down. That has slowed down here lately, but as I said, it’s going pretty well, that a lot of the big companies, I mean… Sorry, residential side is still leaving to go to Jackson Hole. The day after Thanksgiving we’re doing a project out there, so that’s the next big one I’ve got coming up.
Clay: Okay, yeah. You had mentioned before I got recording that you were getting read to head out to Wyoming. How long do one of these projects take?
Geoff: It depends. Another thing I do differently, not than everybody but a lot of people, is all of these things take a lot of setup. Just like networks would take a lot of setup, anything electronic there’s firmware updates, which are very similar, I guess, kind of to… Everyone’s used to seeing their Windows updates, so there’s updates to the equipment, there’s setting you have to do and software to set up and all of those kind of things. I’ve spent about the last two weeks doing the setup here in my shop, and then we pack everything out, go. It’s just the install side instead of all of the setup, so we’ll probably knock it out in about a week, whereas normally it would have been a two- or three-week job. It should go, knock on wood, it should go pretty good.
Clay: Okay. Nice, nice. Correct me if I’m wrong, it sounds like you don’t do any more of the international traveling anymore? That’s your minority partner who bought the rest of the business?
Geoff: That’s correct. I do have… One thing that had fallen by the wayside for a long time were the home theaters. People had gotten into more doing… they didn’t really do as much a room or just a dedicated room. We’re seeing more multi-purpose rooms, but with COVID and everything, I don’t know if that’s what it is or just happens to be at the same time, but we’re doing a lot more theaters. I’ve got a friend that’s in London that I partner with to provide the equipment and help do setup, which we’ve had to postpone one now and can’t fly over, really, because that’s, like I said, something that had kind of fallen back.
Clay: That makes sense, though, if everybody’s got to be home that theaters are kind of open in a way. It seems to be changing every day, but that totally makes sense that theaters would kind of be coming back, or home theaters, excuse me, would be coming back when everything is so locked down.
Geoff: Right.
Clay: Are you into the markets at… Let me ask you this way. What brought you back into the chat room? What was it like, two weeks ago or something?
Geoff: Yeah, so kind of to continue the saga of my friend that had been my mentor years ago, so my oldest son, who’s 22, he had been interested in the markets and that kind of thing. He had asked me if my buddy needed any help because he’s older and he gets a lot of good tips, my friend does, but it’s rear entry and things like that, so he’s looking for some help. My oldest son’s name is Jake. I had him contact him. They kind of got together so he’s worked out a deal with him where he does research and gets on the conference calls and makes the phone calls and digs around trying to find diamonds in the rough, so to speak, trying to find something that’s hard to find and then if he finds it, then my buddy buys it and then he gets 20% of the profit when if/you know-
Clay: I was going to say, hey, if it’s always a win [crosstalk 00:15:47] then I need that contact information, too, but if. There we go.
Geoff: Correct, but he’s in the long-term plays that they’ve in that… The good [inaudible 00:16:02] is that my buddy, like, let’s say, he’ll get the call and Jake will tell me, “This one’s looking like this,” or whatever and does all of the research. Well, he might buy a hundred thousand dollars of it or $200,000 or whatever and doesn’t care because he’s got the kind of money to do it. If it does pay off, then 20% is pretty big. We’ll see how it goes for him. I figured at least it’ll be a learning experience for him if nothing else, so [crosstalk 00:16:28]-
Clay: When [crosstalk 00:16:28]-
Geoff: … the reason I popped in the chat room was because he had told me about a… Go ahead.
Clay: I was just going to say when did this-
Geoff: This started about six weeks ago.
Clay: Okay, okay, so is there any updates in the sense of have there been any recommendations? If so, how have those recommendations turned out? Or are they still-
Geoff: Right, right.
Clay: … in play? I get it, you’re long term. Six weeks could easily fall into a long-term-type trade.
Geoff: Yeah. They’re still ongoing. I don’t remember what… I popped in the chat room because of the one. I was too late to get into it, but it was one that… It was a penny stock, which, of course, we’re not usually in, but another friend of mine still plays with them and he was still in it when it was… It had jumped up to like, I don’t know, 18 cents or something, but then they were getting listed on the Nasdaq and it was climbing, and so I had popped in the chat room to see if anybody was on it. I don’t know where it’s gone right now, but I know it kept jumping up and, of course, while it was jumping up, there’s a lot of people taking their money, as they should. We’ll see how that one plays out, but that’s kind of the…
Clay: Your son is [crosstalk 00:17:45]-
Geoff: … that was a little more riskier play it looked like to me, but we’ll see.
Clay: Your son is recommending penny stocks to this guy? Or is that just-
Geoff: No, no. This was one that another friend of mine that’s in pennies was going-
Clay: Oh, okay-
Geoff: … so-
Clay: … sorry. That guy must have a whole lot of money if he can just be chucking hundred thousand, $200,000 into a penny stock, but okay, that makes-
Geoff: Yeah. Hope you can get it back out. No, no-
Clay: Yeah, yeah, exactly. I [crosstalk 00:18:10] was going to say it. Buying’s not really too much of an issue, but when it comes to sell, that might be a very quick learning lesson on the problems of illiquid penny stocks, but okay, that makes a little bit more sense.
Geoff: Yeah. No, no, no.
Clay: Are you in the markets at all right? Are you-
Geoff: Currently, I’m not in the market at all.
Clay: And-
Geoff: I’ve got some money sitting there, it’s funded, but I haven’t really felt comfortable myself with anything just sitting in something, so kind of waiting because after this project from probably mid-December till February, which of course is going to be a kind of crazy time, so we’ll see how much trading I do then, too.
Clay: Are you looking to… You did options, right?
Geoff: Yep, yeah, that’s what I still do.
Clay: Is that what you’re still… Okay, so that’s-
Geoff: Yeah.
Clay: … what you would be looking to do? I mean, if-
Geoff: Absolutely.
Clay: … an opportunity showed up, let’s just call it next week, if something showed up, and I realize you have your job and all of that sort of stuff, but if an opportunity showed up, are you in the position where you’d be willing to take it? Or are you just-
Geoff: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Clay: … okay. Now-
Geoff: Yeah, if there was a real opportunity, because obviously one of the benefits all of us have now is pop out the phone or the iPad or whatever. You can trade. You can kind of keep up with things, so if it was something real, looked pretty solid, I could do something.
Clay: Okay, so that brings up the next question. What would you identify, what you would deem worthy of… Let me ask it [inaudible 00:19:48]. What is your definition of “an opportunity?” What would that look like?
Geoff: Good question. Because of my current situation where I want to watch it every day, some sort of opportunity would definitely be something that was at least a few days, a few weeks trade. Like if I had been in… We’re back to where one of the stocks feel because of COVID but they’re a solid company and obviously going to, well, not obvious, seems obvious that they’re going to recover once everything gets back to normal, then… If was a couple of months, three, four months back, then there were probably some opportunities.
Geoff: I know there were opportunities I missed then, so if something like that presented itself again where it felt like there was going to be a move, then that’s what I would want to get in on. Not so much something that was only going to be in probably a couple of days because probably it would move too fast for where I’m at right now, but something I could actually kind of just check in on and keep going. Something more solid would be better.
Clay: Okay. Now [crosstalk 00:21:03] before I go into this next part, just for listeners’ sake, disclosure, we record these and then there is a little bit of a lag time, so by the time you as the listener are hearing this, what I’m about to ask Geoff and what his thoughts are, it might be a great idea, it could be a terrible idea because maybe the opportunity has already come and gone, so just realize that. There is a little bit of a lag time between these episodes. You’re mentioning all of this stock. Looks like it’s going to recover or… Do you have any broad ideas of what you could see that as a stock that, “Oh, that looks like it would be a good deal?” What kind of stocks would you be looking at that you would deem into that category that you just described?
Geoff: This is same, where I actually have not even… Except for seeing that Tesla did that pop a couple of days ago, I haven’t even looked at anything. If the airline industries, if any of those are still down, like Boeing, they’ve gotten clearance. Like I said, they may have already popped, but I know they got their clearance to fly again.
Geoff: I’d be interested at looking into if someone came out and said that the mask mandate… Biden said that… Not getting political at all, taking one side or the other, but I know that Biden said that the mask mandate is going to be federally mandated once he’s in office, so I know people who make masks are probably making a killing. I’d look into that sector, what’s going on with any of those PPE supplies because they’re talking about wearing masks even with the vaccine till 2022. That’s got to be a business and, like I said, these things are ripe. I’m sure a lot of that’s already been factored in.
Geoff: Anything entertainment, though, if I can get in entertainment cheap now, I’d be getting into that because people aren’t going to sit around forever, right? They’re going to go back to [crosstalk 00:23:08]-
Clay: They’re going to go a little stir-crazy.
Geoff: … even more so once they’re clear to wanting to fly and take cruises. Absolutely, right? Like I said, this isn’t any big revelation turning on a light bulb for any of the listeners right now. This is obvious. I think that’s probably what I would look at. Anything that’s been beaten down, that a company’s solid, well-known name, Boeing, any of the cruise lines, anything like that that aren’t fly-by-night that probably aren’t going out of business would be worth looking into.
Geoff: Of course, real estate, I don’t know how everywhere else in the country, but here is insane. We’re one of the fastest growing [inaudible 00:23:51] and it used to be large acres. Tracts would sit for months if not years before they sell. Now, stuff is staying on the market less than 30 days. Lots of people moving out, getting out of the city, trying to be more self-reliant, that kind of thing, too.
Clay: Yeah-
Geoff: It’s huge right now.
Clay: … yeah. This is the data point of two locations, but it sounds like… Where are you at in North Carolina exactly? Or if you’re willing-
Geoff: In Raleigh.
Clay: … to disclose. Okay, so [crosstalk 00:24:18] Raleigh, North Carolina.
Geoff: Yeah.
Clay: Grand Rapids, Michigan, where I’m at, I can confirm crazy, crazy, especially where I live right now. I mean, a house goes up and it does not last. If it’s priced even remotely close to fair, it’s gone very quickly. The real estate market is definitely very spicy right now. Now, before I forget, though, I do want to come back to real estate because you mentioned that you were doing some stuff there. I certainly want to hear more about that, but let’s say you identify one of these, just to make the example easy, cruise lines. Cruise lines get to some sort of point. You’re like, “Okay, that is a good opportunity.” What sort of option strategy would you be actually using?
Clay: I know you said you wanted to last more than just a couple of days, so how would you structure that from an options perspective? I guess what I’m getting at here is there’s lots of listeners and they’re going to be sitting here saying, “You know, I really can’t get involved in the markets because I have a job and I’m not around from 9:30-
Geoff: Gotcha.
Clay: … “to 4.” To the people that do have those full-time jobs, a lot of times people are just unaware of, “Oh, really? You can actually ‘have a trade?’ You can make a trade and this trade will last more than just a couple of minutes or a couple of hours?” How would you structure something from your perspective-
Geoff: Oh, my gosh-
Clay: … as a guy with a full-time job? There’s a cruise line, you identify it. You’re like, “Okay, that’s an opportunity. Now, I want to make money from it.” Take it from point.
Geoff: Gotcha. Okay, yeah. I almost always sell options. I don’t buy options. I’m a big believer in letting the time work for me, not against me, letting that time decay work. I would sell something. Of course, it’s very difficult to do unless you’ve got a lot of capital, way, way, way, way out of the money. Well, even then, it’s difficult to do that without just doing a spread, but I would sell that option. Maybe if I thought it was going to be in the range for a while, of course, you could do a straddle or you could do a couple of other things, but I like to sell options and then let the time decay work.
Geoff: I do monthlies. I don’t usually do weeklies. That was something I noticed and got my interested piqued back up. It seemed like there was a lot of premium in the market because of the volatility and everything being unknown. If there’s still any of that going on, that would be great if it’s…
Clay: Are you looking to sell? How far out do you usually like to go? From both a time perspective and then strike prices, what does that normally look like?
Geoff: I’m usually at least 30 days out, so there’s still some good premium into it and you have a little bit of time to do something, too. Usually, I will sell. It depends, but my target would be anywhere from 20 to 50% of whatever that was, but I usually don’t get greedy beyond that because I’ve gotten burned a lot doing that. I’ll always take profits as a good motto, and if you really feel good about the trade and these are all basic things, too, but take enough to cover what your initial trade was and then lead the rest on if you really feel good about it.
Geoff: Even when last time I [inaudible 00:28:01] trading and when I’m trading again, that used to be right, so that’s just learning, but always take profits. You can make more money by preventing losers than guessing the winners, I think, so-
Clay: Well, you’re absolutely-
Geoff: … that ought to work.
Clay: … right and options, there does reach a point where, “I’m not quite at maximum profit. I’m not quite at as much as I could make,” but is trying to eke out just a little bit more… Statistics and options I’d say, “Yeah, you know what? I get it. You’re not at max, but is really worth it to just keep on holding, keep on holding?” No, it’s not worth it-
Geoff: Right.
Clay: … and that can all be quantifiable within the world of options. Geoff is absolutely right. There does reach a point where it’s like, “Yeah, even if I do feel strongly about it, is it really worth it from a statistical perspective?” Probably not, but another cool thing about options is there is pretty much never-ending rabbit holes. You can get as creative as you want. You can form your own opinions and both people can have different opinions, but both people based on their numbers and strategies can be totally valid. Options is a vast, vast world and why it’s so flexible. So much so that you could be day trader of options. You could buy and sell options in the same exact day, in the same exact hour, in the same exact 30 minutes if you really wanted to.
Clay: Or, you can do what Geoff would need and want to do. We are holding these options for weeks upon weeks. The options market, it is crazy how vast it is. The other nice thing about options, especially from Geoff’s perspective from a more so swing trading, is that if you’ve ever had stocks and a stock just gaps up or down against you, now, of course, that can be really good, but it can also be really bad if it gaps against whatever direction your position is in. Geoff, I’ll bring you in here because I know you have a lot of experience. That is the one benefit about options, though, right? You can have gaps and, to an extent, it doesn’t matter which direction it gaps, right? If you set up some of these strategies the right way?
Geoff: That’s correct. Plus, that’s where I got into talking about the naked option versus hedging it a little bit and having your spread, so right. Now, if you’re naked, if a listener doesn’t know, if you’ve just sold your option [crosstalk 00:30:25]-
Clay: Yeah, this got really crazy. This got really awkward if they don’t know what naked… yeah. Why don’t you explain what being naked in the world of options represents? If there’s kids in-
Geoff: Right.
Clay: … the car, well, it’s probably too late. The parents probably already hit the pause button like, “Wait, what are these weirdos talking [crosstalk 00:30:40]?” Yeah, things just went off the rail really quick for them. Why don’t we add in a little bit more context?
Geoff: We should have put a disclaimer at the beginning of this.
Clay: Maybe I will. The intro will be like-
Geoff: Yeah [crosstalk 00:30:51]-
Clay: … “Things get awkward for a second, but it corrects itself very quickly.” The conversation will turn [crosstalk 00:30:57]-
Geoff: Yeah [crosstalk 00:30:58]-
Clay: … apparently [crosstalk 00:30:58] on a dime if you’ve never heard of the world of options, but just give us [crosstalk 00:31:00]… yeah, yeah. Just stick with it exactly. All right, I’ll let you [crosstalk 00:31:04]-
Geoff: Just stick with it [crosstalk 00:31:04]-
Clay: … yeah, yeah. Stick with it because Geoff is going to provide some context-
Geoff: Oh, no [crosstalk 00:31:07]-
Clay: … right now.
Geoff: Yes. Yeah, so if you sell your option and, I don’t know, what’s Tesla even at today? We can use that as [crosstalk 00:31:19] write this down.
Clay: We’ll just call it 500.
Geoff: Okay, so if it’s at 500 and you think it’s not and you sell a $600 put, well, then you think it’s going up, so it’s the opposite. That’s what you’ve always got to keep in mind, or if you sell a $600 call where you’re hoping it’s cheaper. If all you do is sell that option, then you’re out there “naked.” Then, they’re constantly doing some sort of mathematical computation and they’re coming up with if this goes against you, you know, because usually… Well, let me back up. Usually, if you short a stock, you know [crosstalk 00:32:07]-
Clay: I’ll help you [crosstalk 00:32:08] out here. I’m going to provide [crosstalk 00:32:09]-
Geoff: … how much you can make and how much to lose.
Clay: … some cover fire here for you. So [crosstalk 00:32:13] when you are naked, that just means that from an options perspective, your risk is theoretically unlimited. Things could get-
Geoff: Perfect.
Clay: … really, really, really bad if you are naked. Now, if you do it the right way, the chances that things get really, really, really bad again, assuming you’re doing it the right way, are super, super small, but the potential is there for things to get really, really bad because naked just means unlimited risks. If you want to clothe yourself a little bit, clothing yourself means you’re bringing in some risk mitigation, some risk control parameters when you’re structuring these trades. Does that help you out a little bit there in the-
Geoff: Yeah, perfect-
Clay: … okay.
Geoff: … perfect. Right, but then you’ve bought an option that’s further out so that you’ve got that channel that you’re limited your risk because if you don’t do that, you, of course, can make the most money. I did that some on Tesla back a couple of years ago and things will get hairy. It moves and it doesn’t have to move a lot. It can move $10 against you and it shows that they want you to cover it, so I use tastyworks. Of course, I know everybody uses different platforms, but they’ll want you to make sure you have enough in your account to cover it.
Geoff: They usually do that right when you make the trade, so if you don’t have any protection on it… I think there were times that I was on a trade that max it was going to make was, let’s say, three grand and they might have 12 or $14,000 kind of held in my account because they were looking at how bad could it get before they just close you out if you don’t do anything about it, so a margin call. Well, it really wasn’t margin, but I guess that’s [crosstalk 00:34:07] how they looked at it, but anyway.
Geoff: If you have a lot, a lot of money, that’s a really great way to make pretty good money because when Tesla [inaudible 00:34:19] way out of the money. The further out you are the money, the “safer you are” when you’re selling options that it’s not going to move that far and you’re going to make your money. That’s what you want. A lot of things, you get way out of the money and there’s just no premium and there’s no opportunity to make money, but [inaudible 00:34:44] it does stupid things and overnight it can jump 50, a hundred bucks, so-
Clay: I want to clarify one thing because it sounds bad and it is bad without… You did address it in a roundabout way, but when Geoff said, “Well, if you’re looking at a position and you know you can make $3,000 on it, but potentially you could lose maybe 12 or $15,000 on it,” that sounds like really bad like, “Wait a second, you’re risking $15,000 to make 3,000.” Yes, but again, you have to keep in mind the context that if you’re doing it right, the probabilities are hugely, hugely in your favor. That doesn’t mean that it can’t get bad, but it’s not quite as… You’re right. If this was a traditional trading sense and somebody’s risking $15,000 to make 3,000, that’s not going to be viable very long at all, but in the world of options, percentages, probability of profit, all of that sort of stuff has a much bigger influence on things, but yes, on the surface that does sound really bad. That’s why-
Geoff: Right.
Clay: … Geoff is saying when you make things improbable, and that’s really the goal of options trading is, or swing trading, that is, making things improbably where it’s probably not going to happen because you don’t want it to happen. Whatever that it is, you’re trying to structure like, “Yeah, there’s no way that this is going to occur within this amount of time.” That’s Geoff bread and butter here, right? You’re just trying to put together improbably situations.
Geoff: Absolutely.
Clay: Yeah, and it can [crosstalk 00:36:19]-
Geoff: Yeah, exactly what I was going at, yeah. It’ll show on paper and in your account that you’ve risked a lot, whereas realistically, you probably haven’t, or the probabilities are that you haven’t. As far as they’re concerned, they cover themselves, your trading platform does.
Clay: Yeah, absolutely.
Geoff: One other problem, I did run into options… Go ahead.
Clay: No, no, go ahead. Nope, I-
Geoff: Yeah. A problem that I did run into with options that I did not as much just trading stock is the day trading gruel because if you don’t the position on all at the same time, so… Excuse me. Some people want to step into a trade, this is what they call it, and some people will leg out, too. That can cause some problems, especially if you have to do some moves in the same day, every trade that’s counting toward to see if you need to do some moves. I probably hit the day trading… I would get lags for day trading more with options than I ever did with stocks. Then, I guess it’s still… I keep, what, 25 grand in the accounts is where they’re at now.
Clay: Yeah, but [crosstalk 00:37:38]-
Geoff: That was a little more [crosstalk 00:37:38] of a headache with options than what I ran into with, like I said, before, but the strategy we’re talking about now, that wouldn’t be a problem but something to keep in mind. You might want to be a little more flexible to be able to move into options than… I guess depending on how you trade stocks, obviously the same problem, but it just seemed like there was a little more… I definitely got flagged for that a few times. Then, I’d just dump money in there so they’d stop. I think now they’ve got… I saw tastyworks… now they’ve got margin but you got to be 200 grand or something to get their margin account with them, but I don’t know what everybody’s using these days. I know Ameritrade’s always been big and I think a few other things.
Clay: Well, the secret [crosstalk 00:38:28] sauce is known as Robinhood. Have you heard [crosstalk 00:38:30] of [crosstalk 00:38:30]… Have you heard of Robinhood? It is…
Geoff: Is that the runaround with my phone and just trade away?
Clay: Yeah, yeah. It is [crosstalk 00:38:38] a magical, mystical place where you just click a button, download, and money just starts popping out of your phone. It literally just comes right out of the screen. It is a fantastic… No, it’s… Yeah, there is many platforms, and thank you for bringing that up because you are right. You’re also right in the sense of, “Well, this issue about pattern day trading can get a little squirrelly,” and which is true, but it also depends on how you’re doing it, what sort of strategies you’re going.
Clay: The morale of the story here, though, and the good point was that I hear it all of the time. “Hey, am I going to jail because I just got a PDT violation?” Or, “Hey, what’s going on?” It’s like, “No, you’re not going to jail, but one of those things where worst case you can just switch brokers,” but eventually you’re going to run out of brokers. That whole PDT rule, it is [crosstalk 00:39:28] something that absolutely needs to be factored in within whatever strategy you’re looking to do. This really goes to anything. If we’re trading stocks, make sure to factor that in. Even if you’re in the world of options, it can still bring about and factor some things in.
Clay: I want to ask about your platform because, again, that’s just a very common question, and for all we know, there’s somebody listening right now that’s got a full-time job [crosstalk 00:39:52] that’s kind of out there quite a bit and they might be wondering, “Hey, you know, this option thing is sounding good, but where exactly do I start with platforms?” Again, this is not an endorsement of Tasty… Well, is it tastytrader [crosstalk 00:40:03] or tastyworks? These [crosstalk 00:40:06] tasty… Well, I feel like it was [crosstalk 00:40:11] one thing at one point and then I changed. Let me-
Geoff: It’s tastywork.com, but it’s tastytrade with the little cherry-looking-
Clay: Yeah, yeah. Okay [crosstalk 00:40:22] the actual platform, yeah, there it is. tastyworks, okay.
Geoff: Yeah.
Clay: tastyworks, what do you like about it? Why did you choose that one over platforms as far as options is concerned?
Geoff: Gotcha. A couple of years ago, the reason I chose them then was because at the time, they were the only ones that were going [inaudible 00:40:42] of options trading because, of course, you’re buying a hundred contracts and all of that. It was they were way cheaper than… Who was I with before? Etrade, so they were way cheaper than them. I know I’ve heard a lot of the other companies have came down and all of that. The other thing was they based their entire… They’re the guys that started Ameritrade’s thinkorswim, so the guys that, I don’t know if it’s all of them, but part of the people that created thinkorswim are the ones that own tastyworks.
Geoff: You can just go on there, enter your trades, and do thinks just like you would from probably any platform. They all say that they’ve got the show. Of course, anyone can watch, but then while you’re trading through the day, you’re getting input. They have shows all through the day. There’s a lot of education, so if you really want to learn options, and they’ve got futures and everything now, too, so if you’re into any of that grade, it’s just another educational tool. That’s what got me into them to begin with was the cost and the info, the educational input.
Clay: Do you find their platform really easy to use? Or-
Geoff: Yeah [crosstalk 00:42:05] yes, yes. It’s super simple. I’ve got it pulled up now. It’s pretty easy to go through. They’ve got a group of traders and you can watch what they’re trading onto. You’ll see what they’re doing. They’re explaining why they did it. Excuse me. I can go in pretty easily and you can click on a couple of things and it figures out your price for you and where you’re at. You can just send it. It’s really fast. It’s what I got used to using and it’s been great. You can go on the same platform.
Geoff: I’m looking at Tesla options, but if I decided, “Hey, I want to hedge it and I want to go ahead and buy stock, too,” I can do that. Just one-button click. It shows [crosstalk 00:43:06] of course, you’ve got the charts and you can pick out a few, so you’re kind of watching what the S&P’s doing, all of that.
Clay: Yep, yep, and the good thing about not necessarily tastyworks, but any respectable platform, is I know we’ve been talking about statistics a little bit and probabilities and, “Well, how do you make these determinations? How are you determining what’s probable? What’s improbable?” Do I need like a spreadsheet? It sounds like, do I need a degree in mathematics? You [crosstalk 00:43:36] do not? All of these-
Geoff: No.
Clay: … platforms are doing these calculations for you. Now, of course, you need to understand what you’re looking at. You will need to understand and come up with your own ideas about how you’re going to take that data and try to mold it and maneuver it into a money-making opportunity for yourself, but as far as actually deriving these numbers and figuring out all of this sort of stuff, the platforms do it for you. There’s always-
Geoff: Right.
Clay: … questions every now and then. It’s like, “Well, you know, I’m not really good with spreadsheets,” or, “I’m not really good with algebra and all this sort of stuff. I’m not quite sure I can get into options.” It’s like, “Well, no. You don’t have to make any of these calculations yourself.
Clay: The platforms will do all of that for you.” That’s why ease of use is a good thing because when it’s very clear, they make everything visually appealing about what the numbers are, then… I mean, you can really go down the mathematical rabbit hole if you want about why the numbers are the way they are. I’m not saying you shouldn’t do that. If you’re just math person, you love that sort of stuff, then have at it. You will love the world of options, but in no way, shape, or form is that some sort of requirement that you have to have a PhD in Mathematics or anything like that, and-
Geoff: Right.
Clay: … I mean, when you used to trade via the options, how long do you think your average trade actually lasted? On top of that, how often were you checking in on the trades?
Geoff: I’d say about two weeks. Probably on a three-day trade, probably about halfway through and sometimes less. There might be a big move the way I need to move and, of course, you get out or whatever, but on average was around two to three weeks, 18 days is sticking out in my mind for some reason. I have no idea why. Maybe it’s because it’s kind of in between, but no longer than three weeks.
Geoff: Once you get into that last week, then you’re watching it every single day and you’re constantly on it because just little moves can push it the wrong way or the right way really fast. I was watching it every day. I could have had less trades on. There were times where I had five trades at a time, so that got to be a lot, a decent amount to keep up with, so-
Clay: You slightly [crosstalk 00:46:03] cut out how many [crosstalk 00:46:04]? Did you say five at a time?
Geoff: About 25.
Clay: Oh, 25 [crosstalk 00:46:07]-
Geoff: 25.
Clay: Okay, okay. All right [crosstalk 00:46:10]. There we go. Oh, correct me if I’m wrong because I’m talking about it through your eyes, but if I wanted, I as Geoff, wanted to be able to free up my time more just because I have a full-time job, I can’t be like checking these things all of the time every single day, a way I could do that is just decrease the amount of trades I have on to five or less? Is that-
Geoff: Yeah.
Clay: … something you could do if you wanted [crosstalk 00:46:36] to make it? I can see somebody saying, “Wait a second, I thought you were supposed to be able to do these things with a full-time job and here this guy is checking them every single day, multiple times a day. I can’t do that.” That is because that bit of context matters [crosstalk 00:46:48]. When you have 25 positions on at once, that is quite the options farm you’re running at that point.
Geoff: Yeah, absolutely. You’re going to know when you’re getting into it if the option or stock in that matter that you get into is something that’s really volatile and something you have to keep an eye on, but if it’s not, a lot of people trade the index and they do a lot with the… On a blank, but you know, with money. You [inaudible 00:47:21] what’s the… ETFs?
Clay: Yeah [crosstalk 00:47:24]-
Geoff: That right?
Clay: … ETFs and yeah, exactly, and those things can track bonds and all sorts of stuff, yep.
Geoff: Yeah. There’s a lot of things that you can trade that you could have two to five trades on and, of course, there’s also things you can do to set where it’ll automatically sell for you or buy or whatever you need it to do, too. I’d say yeah, if you keep it manageable and just… What I’ve done is when I look at a trade, it’s just like… well, it’s not just like gambling. I don’t want to set that precedent, excuse me, but what are you willing to risk? You should have your stocks set and you should have your percentages.
Geoff: Limit Loss is this great tool and I know you’ve talked about it a lot in your courses and in the chat room and things. I took all of your courses and they were great. I highly recommend that, too, and limiting your losses and all of that, but you’ve got to spread it around a little bit. You’re always going to regret when that big one hits and you’re going to say, “Wow, if I’d had all of my money in that, that would have been so much money.” Just remember your losses, too, and if you had-
Clay: Yeah-
Geoff: … had all of your money in your losses [crosstalk 00:48:44]-
Clay: … there’s another voice [crosstalk 00:48:45] that never shows up that says, “Hey, can you [crosstalk 00:48:47] imagine if you had all of your money [crosstalk 00:48:48] in that one?”
Geoff: Whatever your risk is, you know?
Clay: No, you’re absolutely right, and I know what you mean about the whole gambling comment. Geoff was just saying if you’re going to go to a casino-
Geoff: Whoo.
Clay: … it would be a good money management situation to be saying, “Okay, after I lose this amount, I’m done, like my fun is over.” That’s what I mean. He doesn’t mean that trading-
Geoff: Yeah, that’s comparable, right-
Clay: Yeah, yeah-
Geoff: … percentage.
Clay: … you don’t mean that, “Hey, this whole options thing is just like a slot machine. It’s totally random. You have no idea.” No, you can structure things, so it’s not gambling in that sense, but it is a good money management standpoint, whether you’re gambling at a casino or in the markets to just say, “Hey, this is the amount I can lose, and if I lose it, I need to tap out. I need to be done.”
Geoff: Yep.
Clay: You don’t need to be at the casino going to the… however that even works, the ATM machine and sticking your… Have you ever seen Vegas Vacation with Chevy Chase?
Geoff: Yeah.
Clay: Yeah, that’s just what I always think of, him just draining the bank accounts and everything else. I know what you meant there. Fair to say, there are plenty of ways where depending on your personal situation as somebody with a full-time job and doesn’t have all of the time, you can focus on not only the amount of positions you have, but just based on what you are trading, some things are going to be less volatile than others. By doing all of these, you can make it and structure things in a situation where maybe you could just check every day at lunch or maybe you need to check every other day at lunch. Would you agree that is all possible?
Geoff: Oh, absolutely. Plus, you can set alerts. Set [crosstalk 00:50:20]-
Clay: Good point, yeah [crosstalk 00:50:20]-
Geoff: It’ll alert you if it goes too high or too low a certain way. There are a ton of tools now where you can make your trades and not have to watch it. That’s what I’ll be doing because I’ve got a lot going on, so as I’m getting back in to wanting to make some trades, then.
Clay: That does make good sense, and that’s almost like we scripted this. That’s a perfect segue into where I want to bring us in as we start to wrap things up, but as you’re getting ready to… You’re ready right now, as we talked about earlier, if an opportunity arises, but what is your broad approach in the sense of, how many positions do think you’re going to want to have on at once? How volatile of assets do you want to be trading? I realize that maybe you don’t have it nailed onto a fine tee here, but in generally speaking, what does this look like for you going forward as you get back into the markets?
Geoff: Yeah. It reminds me of one other point I wanted to bring up, too, but yeah, I plan to keep it less than 10 positions. I’ll probably actually will stay between one and five just for a while, especially seeing what happens with the next couple of months. Obviously are going to be huge to see how things go and where they’re at. I’ll be doing that, and one thing I wanted to point out before I forget is when we were talking earlier about ekeing out ever little percentage and kind of being methodical with taking your profits. The cool thing about options to remember, too, is buy something and I’ve got 30 days on it. I’ve gotten a 14 days and I’ve got 50% of my profit because I sold it, so the time decay is working like it’s supposed to and yada, yada, yada.
Geoff: Even if I feel really good about where it’s going, I can just sell that position and I can buy the same option, but just an extra couple of weeks out or whatever. You can always reset yourself on those two. I kind of wanted to mention that.
Clay: No, that [crosstalk 00:52:35]-
Geoff: Just a little different thing you can do with options than you would do with stocks, I guess.
Clay: No, you’re absolutely right, and that’s actually a perfect example of what I was talking about earlier where the rabbit holes are basically unlimited, I mean-
Geoff: Right.
Clay: … the creativity that you can deploy and have it be valid creativity. You can get creative with stocks, but that doesn’t mean than any of it’s actually smart. Yeah, you got creative in a really dumb way. It’s like, “No.” Options, you can get creative-
Geoff: Trust me. There’s always ways to be dumb when you’re dealing in the market, that’s for sure.
Clay: Yeah, that is true, that is true.
Geoff: There’s no lack of that.
Clay: Yeah. However, options, from a strategic standpoint, there’s really a whole lot you can do and it’s actually valid. Okay, I can understand why you would be doing that, but why you would be doing “that,” there are a whole lot of that’s out there. I guess that’s probably the best way to put it, but yeah, you’re absolutely right. From a money management and kind of repositioning and just angling, we could do hours upon hours of… Some people you could have on say, “No, I don’t disagree with that,” or, “I don’t disagree with that because if you do this it makes it a little bit better.” Both people could have good cases and both people can make good money, but the option sea is vast.
Clay: We’ll start to wrap things up, but as somebody that has been there, has done stupid things, has learned some hard lessons, and somebody that is listening to this saying, “Okay, I want to give this a go,” what would you tell that person? What would you tell them as somebody that’s wanting to and they’re new and just getting starting into the options market?
Geoff: Well, number one would be, and I never had the patience for this, but looking back, so if you can paper trade, especially if the platform allows you to basically trade with fake money, right? Just see how you’re doing, get the experience because that experience is going to cost you no matter what. It just is, so do you want to get out there and get that experience with your own money? Or you want to use “fake money?” Right? I would recommend doing that. Obviously, all of the education you can get, and then things manageable. I don’t really want to compare it back to gambling, but at the same time, don’t put any money into the market you’re not willing to lose, which should be obvious, especially in the beginning, and get disciplined.
Geoff: I’m not good at this. I still let emotion get in, but if you can be an emotionless trader, you’ll probably be extremely successful, so practice, practice, and know that once you’ve put real money in the market it’s going to cost you something to learn in the beginning, anyway. What you know, I don’t think that applies as much now. You can maybe give some advice on that. If you know a certain sector or maybe stick with something so you really… Once you trade something over and over and over again, you realize the pattern. That’s what happened with me trading Tesla for a while, and I’m sure it’s happened with a lot of people. If you trade the same thing, you start to see that. Of course, if you can use charts, I know a lot of guys are chart traders. That’s a great thing, too.
Clay: No, I agree. Those are all good starting points, absolutely. I think, and I’m curious your thoughts on this, but I would also argue that the one advantage that doing options in the way that we’ve been talking about, though mainly selling options, is you can really develop data-driven strategies we’re you’re like, “I’m looking at this percentages and because this is doing that and these are other things are that and I see this number there, you know what? Odds are, X, Y, Z is going to happen.” Whereas, if you’re just day trading on a stock straight up, you’re not going to be really looking at all sorts of data and having data help to guide you in your decisions.
Clay: You are in some senses, but when you get into the options and, again, going back to the platform, when you get a good platform, that platform’s making this data available to you, you can… It’s not perfect, but it can be, I think, probably the path of least resistance to just get to non-emotional trading. If you can just look at numbers and understand what’s more likely to happen than not, it doesn’t make it totally easy, but I do agree that probably helps out with the emotions and that’s the one thing that-
Geoff: Oh, absolutely.
Clay: … definitely differentiates selling options compared to trading stocks or even just buying options. It’s very data-driven if you’re doing it the right way.
Geoff: That’s correct, and what’s that old adage? Know thyself? You know-
Clay: Exactly.
Geoff: … that’s it. Know what type of person you are. We did a… Long ago, [inaudible 00:57:32] brought a psychiatrist, but I’m sure that’s not what she is. It has to do with that, to come in and evaluate an idea just to see how your brain works and what kind of person you are and all of that. Then, because of the process they use and the tools they use and all of that, it kind of told you what everyone’s strengths and weaknesses are.
Geoff: Their conclusion was don’t try to change their weaknesses as far as when it came to operation of how they think and all of that stuff because it was a losing battle, that to see gains in that avenue, you had to work to their strength. One of my was that I function much, much better with a thousand things going on than with one thing going on, so that’s probably [crosstalk 00:58:22]-
Clay: Interesting.
Geoff: … what it kind of comes down to, like I load myself up when I’m doing things. It was real cool stuff, so if you can kind of do whatever you can do to figure out how you operate, and people probably know this and maybe not even recognizing it, how do you get through the day? What are the things you do to keep tasks done? Do you need to be in a competition? Whatever it is, and then, if you can figure out their strength and put that into your trading strategy, I think that would help, too, because that’s the fascinating thing about the market is there’s room for you’re comfortable with, it’s going to work for you, then make it work on a small scale and then ramp it up.
Clay: You’re absolutely right, and that’s pretty crazy that some people would benefit with just almost the more crazy it gets, the more you thrive, and-
Geoff: Absolutely.
Clay: … yeah.
Geoff: When I don’t have anything going on, it’s horrible.
Clay: Yeah. No wonder-
Geoff: I get into trouble.
Clay: Yeah, No wonder why you had 25 positions on at once, I mean-
Geoff: Yep.
Clay: Maybe the key is to have 50 positions on at once, I don’t know, but that’s-
Geoff: Yeah. I might need to pile on more.
Clay: Yeah. At this trajectory, just the more the merrier, but you’re absolutely right. I agree, play to your strengths when it comes to your mental makeup. Just like trading with the trend, don’t try to fight the trend of all of your shortcomings. Just go with what your mind is structured to do and that seems to be more so going with the trend.
Clay: Now, before we do wrap things up, I do have to ask, though, what’s going on in the real estate front for you?
Geoff: Real estate-wise, we’re buying a large, large tract. Kind of getting into some of the self-sustaining stuff. I’m not going to be the off-grid, no hot water type. I’m not going to call them crazy because they might be the ones that are right, but I’m not going to go that extreme, we’ll say, but we’re doing a little bit more self-sustain like years and years ago. Like growing up on my Mom’s side of the family were all farmers and I ran a farm. We had like a hundred head of cows and chickens and all of that stuff, too. We’re trying to do a new house and kind of be a little more efficient, I guess, is something I’m working on with that, and then-
Clay: Who is we? Sorry to interrupt [crosstalk 01:00:51]-
Geoff: … there’s… Oh, oh. Oh yeah, I kind of skipped that, so I’m engaged.
Clay: Oh, okay. Well, congratulations.
Geoff: Yes, that’s a life event. My fiancee and I, so we’re kind of pushing towards that. It’s not that far from the city. It’s like 20-minute drive to Raleigh, so we’re working on that. There’s a lot of activity around, so we’re getting enough acres that we can kind of… not manipulate it, but down the road is sell some lots off and some things like that. It’s much more of a long-term project, but the airport… When I started out here, the airport owned most of the land and so I’ve basically got two and a half acres in the city, which almost nobody has.
Geoff: It’s starting to crowd me a little bit. The hotels are coming in and all of that, so we had someone come in and talk to us about buying it all to do condos and everything. I’m looking at maybe making a deal on that and sell off some of it and do something exciting. That’s kind of something I’m looking at.
Clay: Seems [crosstalk 01:02:09]-
Geoff: You know how that goes, though, so [crosstalk 01:02:13] lots of stuff going on.
Clay: Yeah, that’s awesome, and you’re right. When it comes to real estate, it’s just like a trade. Before you enter in a trade, you should have some sort of idea about exit plans, and real estate, the same way. To your point, you know that not that you’re going to do it right away, but if you can parcel off some of the land, split it up, that’s always a good management perspective to know if you ever need to exit, there are many ways you can do it where you don’t have to just flat out paint yourself into one corner, but-
Geoff: Right, right.
Clay: … that’s awesome. How many acres are you…
Geoff: This one’s [inaudible 01:02:48].
Clay: Okay, nice, nice.
Geoff: It’s close to the [inaudible 01:02:54]. You can be on the highway in five minutes. They’re building houses around it that are 5, 600,000. It’s a good market, good area to be in, so we’ll see how it works out. We’re still in due diligence stage.
Clay: Well [crosstalk 01:03:15]-
Geoff: We’ll see what happens with it, but-
Clay: … when it comes to real estate, due diligence is absolutely a good thing because there’s sort of like a lot of commas and digits when it comes to real estate. It’s not really like, “Hey, I’m buying a penny stock for a hundred bucks.” Real estate-
Geoff: Right.
Clay: … deals with a little larger numbers, so I’m fully supportive of you doing your due diligence and research. Well, that’s awesome and I’m glad to hear that you’re looking to get back in the market. It sounds like we’ll be seeing you some more in the chat room and-
Geoff: Oh, absolutely.
Clay: … I’m excited to see where things go from here. Did you have anything else you wanted to address? We’re basically right at the hour mark, so [crosstalk 01:03:50]-
Geoff: Yeah [crosstalk 01:03:51] no, you’re pretty good at pulling it out of me, so I think we got it all. I’ll have to save some for podcast four.
Clay: There we go. I like that attitude. We’ll have to try to do it a little bit sooner than what this one was, but to be fair to you, you have been out there just making it happen in many other ways, so I appreciate it, Geoff. It was good to talk with you again and I look forward to continue to not only see you in the chat room, but to see where all of this goes for you.
Geoff: Yeah, likewise. Thanks, Clay.
Clay: All right. Now, before you go, as listeners, a final few things. First off, if you’re listening at claytrader.com, in the show notes page, down below there’s a live trade little, or not a live trade, a little live chat box there. You can click on that, request to speak to a human, and you can just request to speak to one of us. We love to hear from people and listeners.
Clay: Then, also, if you’re listening on iTunes or any of the other podcast players, make sure to subscribe. That way, you know when new content is out, and especially on iTunes, if you could leave us a rating or, even better yet, a written review, that goes a long way. Really helps it out and I definitely, truly, genuinely thank you in advance for doing that. Thank you to all of you as listeners. Thank you to Geoff, and we will see you all back next week.
Announcer: This has been The Stock Trading Reality Podcast. Thanks for taking the time to hang out. To learn more about Clay and the ClayTrader community, including the trading team, Premium Training, and more, visit claytrader.com.